This episode originally aired in 2023 and contains advice that has become increasingly relevant. 00:56 - Introduction Brent Wadas is an Army veteran who has also worked in finance and SaaS. In 2020, he and his two co-founders dove into construction automation with BotBuilt. He joins us today to talk about automated framing. 04:38 - BotBuilt Overview Brent explains why he sometimes feels like a five-year-old. He and his co-founders found that most automated systems required almost complete uniformity. He explains The Panel Book that contains detailed breakdowns of components, designs, and costs. He talks us through how they use industrial robot arms from eBay to building out wall-panel systems. (Watch a video of the process.) The marked, labeled panels then simply need to be properly placed and nailed together. The contractors working with BotBuilt can complete the framing for a single-family residence in 2.5-5 hours using the panels assembled in their facility. Brent compares BotBuilt’s process to that of other automated-construction companies. 08:48 - Ikea-style Assembly Eddie asks how BotBuilt lays out instructions for contractors to assemble their plans. Brent explains that the incredibly detailed plans they did for their first run-through ended up in the mud because the builder just wanted the simplest one-page overview plan. Tyler asks for some more details about the computer programming. Brent talks about the math involved and the challenge of regional code variations. Brent emphasizes that they can work up a schedule with just a PDF version of the plans. He talks about high school intern Joseph, whose fast work pace caught Brent off-guard. 18:26 - Growth, the Future, and Recruiting Brent talks about how far things have come in the last couple years and how quickly things are going to change over the next five years. He talks about his company’s work with Y Combinator. Eddie asks about the challenges of funding such an ambitious business. Brent talks through the way he and his co-founders process those decisions. This conversation includes some insights gained from buying and renovating fixer-uppers. We find ourselves talking yet again about the challenges of getting the younger generations interested in pursuing construction jobs. Brent ties in some thoughts from his time in the military. 35:10 - What to Consider Before Automating Tyler asks Brent to outline the things that owners, contractors–anyone–should consider before automating. Here are Brent’s thoughts: -Reproducibility is the first thing to consider. If you’re looking at a process that repeats the same specs time after time, you might want to consider automation. -Ask yourself, “Is there a problem here?” Don’t automate just because you see other people automating. -Consider the personnel demands. Don’t set yourself up to pay the same people for the same number of hours just to solve a problem in a more complicated, new way. 45:00 - Safety and Legacy We talk about work site safety, and Brent says that you’re 10x more likely to die framing a house than on the battlefield in Afghanistan. He said that 35 service members died every year at the height of the war. 350 people die every year framing houses according to OSHA. He shares how BotBuilt’s consistency, standards, and simplicity can make a dent in these numbers. Tyler and Eddie discuss their experiences with safety practices (or the lack thereof) on their early-career worksites. Rarely if ever was there anyone designated to keep an eye on safety. We discuss how messed up that is. This leads us into a discussion about leadership. 1:00:33 - Megaphone Message Brent has a couple megaphone messages. He wants construction workers to keep hope alive, and he wants people from the tech industry as a whole to please come learn the culture of construction. He wants them to discover the wealth and satisfaction that construction has to offer. Find Brent Online: LinkedIn - BotBuilt Check out the partners that make our show possible. Find Us Online: BrosPodcast.com - LinkedIn - Youtube - Instagram - Facebook - TikTok - Eddie's LinkedIn - Tyler's LinkedIn If you enjoy the podcast, please rate us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to us! Thanks for listening

This is repost of one of our old favorites. If you want to stand out in business, don’t be a whiner. It’s a natural human tendency, for sure. That’s why avoiding it will help you stand out from the crowd. Whining wastes time and strains relationships. The more you can suck it up and do the work when circumstances are tough, the better things will go for you and those around you. Check out the partners that make our show possible. Find Us Online: BrosPodcast.com - LinkedIn - Youtube - Instagram - Facebook - TikTok - Eddie's LinkedIn - Tyler's LinkedIn If you enjoy the podcast, please rate us on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to us! Thanks for listening!

Today we're revisiting a conversation we had with Fouad Khalil in October of 2023. Fouad is the founder of and Principal at Modly, a modular construction consultancy that provides the building and real estate sector with market research, feasibility analysis and advisory services. Today he’s here to share some leadership insights. We jump right into the conversation today with some talk about liability. Tyler asks Fouad to repeat what he had explained in an earlier conversation.Fouad says that your insurance carrier will tell you… -Don’t say, “It will be done this way.” -Don’t get on the job site and direct other teams’ workers on how to do their job. When you do these things, you’re taking on liability. Eddie points out that general contractors get trained to shed liability. This leads to gray areas within the hand-off territory where information degradation occurs. Tyler mentions that some schools are unable to implement shop programs because of insurance costs. 5:03 - Sweden and Building Robust Teams Fouad shares about his experience working on a project in Sweden. He recounts a conversation about potential leaks on structural wood components on the building. The answer about potential leaks was, “We’ll work on the solution together.” Fouad shares about the critical path and lead times. He talks about schedule compression and how every single step in the process can become critical. A shortage of screws can result in a whole project coming to a standstill. He mentions the insights he gained from the book Managing the Unexpected. This book focuses on high-reliability organizations like air-traffic control, NASA, etc. In manufacturing, you can burn through your cash in no time. Efficiency is everything. Fouad wanted to apply this knowledge in his clients’ projects. Fouad talks about the need for humility and honesty in regard to the planning fallacy. We underestimate. 20:36 - Key Lessons from the book We asked Fouad here today to discuss some of the lessons he learned from a book he mentioned to us recently. The book is Managing the Unexpected by Karl E. Weick and Kathleen M. Sutcliffe. Here are the five traits that the authors saw in high-reliability organizations: Operational sensitivity Preoccupation with failure Reluctance to simplify Commitment to resilience Deference to expertise We expand upon each of these briefly. Fouad quotes Churchill: “Plans are useless, but planning is essential.” Eddie discusses the confusion he felt when his college coach told him to work at 90%. His point was to be deliberate and have a reserve. Maintain a buffer. Fouad explains that these principles apply to managing crews of any size. If you don’t manage thoughtfully in these respects, your best people are going to burn out. He gives examples about how to institute quiet times throughout the day when there will be no meetings. Eddie talks about creative use of red Solo cups in the office. 33:20 - Debriefing to Avoid Repetition of the Same FailuresTyler asks Fouad to explain how effective review of failures can ensure improved performance going forward. He talks about the importance of categorizing and analyzing the failures. He refers to various historical failures that were addressed thoughtfully. Eddie connects this to recognition of safety failures even if those don't lead to serious injuries. We also discuss how the principle plays out in relationships with contractors who try to downplay mess-ups. 43:04 - Recognizing the Experts Fouad talks about the distribution of responsibility in specific situations to the people most capable of making the best decision. It’s not about staying loyal to a flow chart. If the lower-ranking person is in a better position to make the judgment, let them make the judgment. Then hand that authority back to the conventionally in-charge figure once the situation has been addressed. It’s about dynamic teams. One more time, here’s the book Fouad brought to our attention today: Managing the Unexpected. Find Fouad Online: LinkedIN Check out the partners that make our show possible. Find Us Online: BrosPodcast.com - LinkedIn - Youtube - Instagram - Facebook - TikTok - Eddie's LinkedIn - Tyler's LinkedIn If you enjoy the podcast, please rate us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to us! Thanks for listening

Despite Tyler’s apathy toward football, today Eddie is encouraging us with a football analogy: stay in the pocket. He explains that the quarterback who trusts his offensive line can examine his options while standing confidently within the pocket. When you’re looking to move the ball down the field, you might be tempted to run off to the side or run backward to an area that looks so peacefully empty. This almost always ends badly. Hang in there and keep surveying your options. Tyler translates this analogy to pickleball. When you’re tempted to slam it from the kitchen, it’s usually better to just keep it going. Step into the hardship. Stay in that pocket. Check out the partners that make our show possible. Find Us Online: BrosPodcast.com - LinkedIn - Youtube - Instagram - Facebook - TikTok - Eddie's LinkedIn - Tyler's LinkedIn If you enjoy the podcast, please rate us on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to us! Thanks for listening!

This is a re-release of an episode that originally aired on September 27 of 2023. 00:00 - Introduction You listen to us, and we listen to you. Today we welcome a guest who engaged honestly and thoughtfully with one of our LinkedIn posts. A while back, when Eddie posted on LinkedIn to say that he wanted designers to have more money and more time in order to produce a better product, Nick stepped up to say that he didn’t think that was always the answer. Nick said that collaboration is also key. Nick is an owner’s rep for an automotive group, and every day he observes the complex dynamics of the construction process. 03:20 - When You’ve Tried… Nick shares about times when he’s paid more for the “correct” design professionals. Sometimes it has panned out, and sometimes it hasn’t. We discuss some of the design and structural characteristics that are unique to the construction of automotive dealerships. Eddie asks Nick to describe the schematics that he hands to his architects. The plans are pretty detailed because space-planning and other elements are crucial to functionality of the space. Nick talks through the accumulating delays that occur in the design stage. He explains how essential it is that designers who are given more time produce designs that are really, truly ready to go. 12:10 - Repeat Projects with Small Adjustments Eddie talks about the unique challenges and advantages of working on projects that are essentially repeats of previous projects. Sometimes small differences in these repeat projects open the doors to slight cost savings–maybe using a 6” stud instead of an 8” one. When that happens, it can take an unreasonably long amount of time to get the designers to make that change. Nick explores the reasons that architects or engineers might not be able to jump on that change as quickly as one would like. Those people are usually working on multiple projects. He talks about how the navigation of this process changed during the COVID-19 pandemic. He goes on to share about a massive beam that unexpectedly appeared on the worksite of a repeat project. He and the other parties were able to find a more affordable substitution because he was willing to ask everyone involved and push for a creative solution. 22:00 - Lessons Learned, Solutions Found Eddie asks Nick to share about some of the things he’s learned from years of encountering these kinds of challenges. Here are a couple things he mentions: -Get together with equipment vendors. Discuss how to replicate parts of the project even when there are minor variations in projects. -Take a close look at the process, including your role. See how you can tweak that process to minimize changes and increase the efficiency of addressing changes that do arise. -Make sure you’re working with designers who actually know how to build buildings–people who actually know about the physical construction process. -Make sure everyone is starting with the same vocabulary and reference points so that the content within designs can be easily understood by the workers on the jobsite. We go on to discuss the timing of change orders and the complications that arise when they’re not timed thoughtfully. Tyler asks Nick how he weighs the various variables in order to make decisions regarding change orders. Nick shares and Eddie contributes some thoughts from his experience. 48:40 - Is There Such a Thing as…? Eddie asks if there is such a thing as a firm that can do top-grade work efficiently for a reasonable price? Nick says that the answer is yes but that it’s complicated. Since teams and partnerships are always changing, you might find your rhythm with one person or firm but then find that the chemistry with the entire team is not the same. Nick mentions that he has upward of 40 projects at a time that are at one stage or in the design or construction process. He talks through the communication principles that make it possible to manage that many projects at one time. 1:05:01 - Nick’s Megaphone Message: Communicate. We’re all trying to do the job. We’re all trying to do more with less resources every day. The more we can be concise and to communicate clearly, the more we’ll make everyone’s job easier. Find Nick on LinkedIn Check out the partners that make our show possible. Find Us Online: BrosPodcast.com - LinkedIn - Youtube - Instagram - Facebook - TikTok - Eddie's LinkedIn - Tyler's LinkedIn If you enjoy the podcast, please rate us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to us! Thanks for listening!

Eddie’s been reading The Comfort Crisis, and from that he brings us this insight: “Hunger is the best sauce.” He shares about his recent trip to the NASCC and an “exquisite” meal he had there. They didn’t go high-end, but it still tasted outstanding simply because they were so dang hungry. Hunger sharpens the olfactory senses. Doing without something can make you really appreciate it when it returns. If you’re going through a dry spell, Eddie encourages you to be okay with that. Consider how much you’ll appreciate things when the tide turns. Hunger is the best sauce. Check out the partners that make our show possible. Find Us Online: BrosPodcast.com - LinkedIn - Youtube - Instagram - Facebook - TikTok - Eddie's LinkedIn - Tyler's LinkedIn If you enjoy the podcast, please rate us on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to us! Thanks for listening!

We start out today with some swag talk and a chat about some recent opportunities to meet listeners. (Note: Of course historicity is a word. Dictionary.com’s definition is “historical authenticity.”) 03:50 - The Panama Canal There’s so much to discuss on this massive construction project. First, though, we insist on a deep dive on our Keurig machine. Then we get to some specs: Parcel of land: 10 miles wide and 50 miles long 85 feet elevation change from sea level to highest point Avg. ship transit time: 8-10 hrs 300,000,000 cubic yards of earth moved in project 52 million gallons of water displaced for each transit (That’s about 742,857 bathtubfuls–roughly the amount of water that passes through Hoover Dam every 14 minutes) Cut the ocean-going distance from NY to LA from 13,000 miles to 5,200 miles Some calculations put the total construction fatalities at 500 lives for each mile of canal. (Total of around 25,600). We discuss the history of Panamanian isthmus exploration by those who were interested in sea navigation. In 1513, Spanish explorer Balboa became the first European to realize that this area was a narrow isthmus b/t Atlantic and Pacific oceans. This eventually led to exploration for a navigable passage. Then in 1534, Charles V, the Holy Roman emperor, ordered a survey to determine if a route could be built. It is considered impossible. By 1881, France decided that indeed it was possible, so they began construction. That attempt led to more than 20,000 deaths–mostly from Caribbean islands such as Antigua, Barbados and Jamaica. 13:06 - Lock History and the Labor Force Eddie runs us through the history of locks, which started in China and included some input from Leonardo DaVinci. Approximately 60,000 people were involved in the American construction project. White workers got the best jobs and the best lodging. Workers died at the incomprehensible rate of 500 for every mile of construction. Many of these deaths were due to disease, but many were also due to mudslides and a range of other predictable types of accidents. 19:09 - New Tools and Chief Engineers We discuss a couple of innovations that made this project possible: The track-shifter (Watch a video clip): huge crane-like machine could hoist a whole section of track–rails and ties–and swing it in either direction, to relocate it as much as 3 m at a time. It took less than a dozen men operating one day to move 1.6 km of track, a task requiring not less than 600 men. The dirt-spreader (See a pic): A car operated by compressed air, the dirt-spreader had steel "wings" on each side that could be raised and lowered to level off material left along the track by the unloader. Did the work of approximately 6000 men working by hand. Eddie lists the men who worked in the chief engineer role and the big money that they earned–more than any other public employee other than the president. The one who finally stuck around to finish the project was George Washington Goethals, who had no choice because he was assigned to this role as an Army general. 27:30 - Economic Impact and Other Takeaways We explore the economic impact of the canal. Shipping costs for goods that would have needed to pass south of South America immediately dropped by 31%. This leads to a discussion of the drought that has caused complications in the canal since last year. We touch on the huge impact caused when shipping lanes are shut down, including the recent bridge collapse in Baltimore. Tyler mentions the fact that automation has been in the works since even this era and we discuss the efforts that were made in regard to personnel management–allowing families to stay near the work sites and providing some of the workers with generous vacation time. Check out the partners that make our show possible. Find Us Online: BrosPodcast.com - LinkedIn - Youtube - Instagram - Facebook - TikTok - Eddie's LinkedIn - Tyler's LinkedIn If you enjoy the podcast, please rate us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to us! Thanks for listening!

(This is a re-air of an episode originally released last September.) Tyler’s been doing some training lately. Eddie has been both working out and listening to ultra-runner Nick Bare’s podcast. Nick talks about running a 230-mile ultra-marathon. Tyler and Eddie are not doing that. During COVID, Eddie was set to run a marathon that ended up being canceled. The Campbell family stepped up and set up a one-man race. When he hit 16 miles, he hit a wall. He was determined not to quit in front of his kids, so he focused on just finishing the next mile. Then the next mile. Then the next mile. We all hit those walls. Sometimes you simply can’t take the long view. You just need to focus on the very next step. Slowly you’ll gather momentum. Eventually you’ll realize that you’re just three miles out. Then two. Then one. Then you’re done. Just do the next mile. Check out the partners that make our show possible. Find Us Online: BrosPodcast.com - LinkedIn - Youtube - Instagram - Facebook - TikTok - Eddie's LinkedIn - Tyler's LinkedIn If you enjoy the podcast, please rate us on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to us! Thanks for listening!

00:00 - The Founding of GPRS Today we welcome Matt Aston. Matt is the founder of GPRS. Although that is an acronym for ground-penetrating radar systems, the company does much more than that these days. Matt started his company in 2001, and now they employ almost 800 people in 54 cities. We discuss the ground-penetrating radar equipment. Matt walks us through some basics about how this equipment uses magnetic variations to help users create a map of the underground infrastructure. When he was starting GPRS, most of his work involved taking readings in concrete–sensing rebar, anchors, etc. As time passed, they shifted toward working with utility contractors before excavations. Matt shares about his dad’s drilling and cutting business in Toledo and how a softball injury forced him to restructure his business. This led to substantial growth that led to a business he might have been interested in taking over. 06:08 - Building a Business on Young Technology, Equipment Overview Matt tells us about an early experience with the stress of the ground-penetrating radar business. On his way to the equipment-training session he was a little scared. On the way home, he was really scared. Eddie asks Matt to talk through ground-penetrating radar tools. He talks through the tools and the process that has enabled his team to reach a 99.87% accuracy record. It involves baby-buggy-like carts and converting screen data to the paint on the ground. A few GPR antennas, a couple for underground and one specifically for concrete. Then there are a few specialized tools, including the handheld wands and sewer cameras. The sewer cameras, along with a few other tools, enable the company to now provide leak-detection services. 15:33 - Training Programs Matt shares about his company’s training programs. Matt explains that they now have 3 full-time trainers. These veteran project managers conduct their training in a facility with a custom-built floor full of all kinds of wire, pipes, and conduit. They also have a simulated gas station complete with tanks. Tyler asks Matt to share about his company’s Trump Tower project in Chicago. This involved a demo and then some code upgrades. This required extensive time-consuming retrofits. He recounts a couple other incredibly ambitious projects. We discuss the increasing sensitivity and precision of the equipment involved. Matt shares about a time when he had to break some unfortunate news with the owners of a scientific facility where the concrete hadn’t been poured to the proper thickness. 29:50 - Unusual Projects and Big-City Projects Tyler asks Matt to share about some of the unorthodox jobs they’ve been called to do. Matt shares a story about a mysterious old site where the client was looking for a large metal container. GPRS has even located a few murder victims. He’s not confirming that one of them was Jimmy Hoffa, but he’s not denying it either. Matt tells a few examples of the interesting variety of locations that this work takes his teams. He gives an example of one crew working in DC who was taken by the National Park Service to scan the lawn at the White House. 37:24 - Entrepreneurship Tyler asks Matt to talk about growing his business. Matt shares about early hires and the challenges of ensuring that the income exceeds the outflow. He discusses decisions that were especially influential, and he shares his thoughts about the role of the companies’ CEOs in both successes and failures. As your company grows, Matt says, your potential also grows. Matt recounts the stages of growth and the points at which you sense shifts in your perception of the business and your role in it. He set some ambitious goals and has found that they’re achievable. He mentions the role that Toledo’s size played in setting his company on a path for growth. Eddie and Matt compare notes on business-growth rewards and challenges. Matt shares about an unsettling conversation he had with a contractor who wanted to avoid knowing in advance about underground elements because he made more money when his equipment damaged them and then he needed to repair them. They agree that it’s all about “meeting the need.” 59:13 - Matt’s Megaphone Message We are capable of so, so much more than we realize. The world around us makes it really easy to be average. If you just show up and do what you said you were going to, you’re already above average. But if you push yourself, you can move into that elite category. Find your why. You can be an elite performer. Find Matt on LinkedIn Check out the partners that make our show possible. Find Us Online: BrosPodcast.com - LinkedIn - Youtube - Instagram - Facebook - TikTok - Eddie's LinkedIn - Tyler's LinkedIn If you enjoy the podcast, please rate us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to us! Thanks for listening

It’s not worth it. You want to sleep at night. Manipulation sometimes comes in the form of straight-up lying, but it also sometimes comes in half-truths, intimidation. Sometimes it even comes in the form of donuts (although we won’t complain too hard about that one). Be a straight shooter. Not only will it keep you from being found out; it will also make life more pleasant for you. Word of mouth is big in the construction industry. Your reputation will precede you. Be the person who shows up when you say you’re going to show up. Take care of problems. Check out the partners that make our show possible. Find Us Online: BrosPodcast.com - LinkedIn - Youtube - Instagram - Facebook - TikTok - Eddie's LinkedIn - Tyler's LinkedIn If you enjoy the podcast, please rate us on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to us! Thanks for listening!

We start out today by considering placing bets on the Sawzall next door, which of course leads us to reflect on our experience with high school bookies. 02:25 - A Full House of Specs Tyler mentions that his first exposure to the Golden Gate Bridge was in the opening to Full House. Then we dive into some specs: The bridge’s span between towers is 4200 feet. The towers reach 746’ height above the water. Each tower weighs 22,000 tons. The total length of the bridge is 1.7 miles. 80,000 miles of steel wire were used to –enough to wrap around the earth 3 times. 1 million rivets We discuss the old-school rivets and a condition that developed among riveters. When the primer paint came into contact with the still-hot rivets, they’d release fumes that led to an odd collection of symptoms. Eddie recalls his first trip over the bridge to Muir Woods, where the Ewok scenes in Star Wars were filmed. Tyler thought about taking a similar trip but lacked confidence in the range of his rented electric vehicle. 09:06 - Joseph Strauss Eddie leads us into a conversation about Joseph Strauss, who headed up the construction of the bridge. Tyler goes bleepy in his review of Strauss’s character. Strauss tended to be a little praise-hungry, tending to brush aside the contributions of others who made substantial contributions to the bridge’s design and construction. We discuss Strauss’s Renaissance-man range of interests and his death soon after the bridge’s completion. Eddie admires Strauss’s idea of creating a scale model of the bridge during the building process. 13:24 - Historical Comparisons, Objections, Divers, etc. We discuss the history of suspension bridges and the unique challenges of constructing a bridge over this particular waterway. Eddie recounts the history of interest in building a bridge that would save massive travel time. A drive around this bay at today’s travel speeds would take 3 hours. He lists the various parties that objected to the bridge’s construction–everything from environmentalists to citizens worried about the naval fleet being prevented from reaching the ocean. (And, of course, you can imagine how worked up the ferrymen were.) Tyler discusses the crucial contributions of the construction divers in those old-school diving suits. We discuss the tasks they completed and the risks they took. 29:00 - Safety Performance, Cables, and AI We express our amazement at the fact that only 11 people died during this project. Considering the safety standards of the day, that was pretty impressive–especially considering the fact that 10 of those deaths occurred in the same incident. That means that if that incident hadn’t occurred, there would have been only a single death in a project completed when some decision-makers considered it acceptable to have one death per million dollars spent on a project. We wonder if part of the reason for that safety was hard hats, which were required for the first time on this project. We review the specs related to the massive cables–up to 3 feet in diameter–that both support the bridge and allow it to flex. These big projects created necessities that mothered inventions. Eddie returns to the topic of naysayers and how we approach the decisions to tackle large projects. We ponder the cost-benefit analyses done with projects like this as they relate to environmental concerns. Tyler connects the learning that occurred and the travel patterns that shifted as a result of the Golden Gate Bridge. He links these considerations to our current perspective on AI. 32:50 - Destination Structures We discuss the cool feelings that come with the construction of projects that have enough of a presence in the national consciousness that people travel just to see them. Tyler says the Great Wall of China is one that he’d like to see. Eddie would like to go up in the St. Louis Arch and to see the Space Needle as well as the Taj Mahal. He’d also love to visit some ancient ones. This prompts us to reflect a bit–thinking that we need to take the time to appreciate the way that people use the things we build. Appreciate the fact that you’re making a difference in people’s daily lives. If you’re interested in learning more about the Golden Gate Bridge and its construction, check out these sources: The Rivets Video clips of the riveting process 1960s mini-documentary Pics of underwater workers Cable pics Pics of south tower “bathtub” History Channel Modern Marvels episode Check out the partners that make our show possible. Find Us Online: BrosPodcast.com - LinkedIn - Youtube - Instagram - Facebook - TikTok - Eddie's LinkedIn - Tyler's LinkedIn If you enjoy the podcast, please rate us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to us! Thanks for listening

Eddie’s gears have been ground. It bothers him when people act like they’re the only one with problems–especially when this leads to them unloading their workload onto someone else. This kind of offense is especially frustrating to managers, owners, or other types of bosses who can’t pass the buck. (We can’t imagine how worked up Eddie will be when he’s an old man.) Ultimately, it’s a basic “do unto others as you’d like them to do unto you” situation. It makes you a better employee, a better coworker, a better friend, a better contractor. Tyler reflects on the sense of entitlement that he had as a young fella in the industry, and we discuss the long-term benefits of making deposits to the trust account of those you work with day in and day out. Check out the partners that make our show possible. Find Us Online: BrosPodcast.com - LinkedIn - Youtube - Instagram - Facebook - TikTok - Eddie's LinkedIn - Tyler's LinkedIn If you enjoy the podcast, please rate us on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to us! Thanks for listening!

Tyler’s struggling with sugar withdrawal. Eddie sometimes doesn’t feel like a real man. Hamzah Shanbari likes his coffee bitter and black. 02:55 - Welcoming Hamzah Shanbari We’re glad to have Hamzah back. It’s been a good, long while–almost three years since he joined us to discuss marketing vs. reality. He’s still achieving more than us. Hamzah now works with Haskell, where he is the Director of Innovation. Haskell has charged Hamzah and his team to invest, invent, and innovate. They do this under an LLC named Dysruptek, that seeks to look with a fresh eye at things that have long been done the same way. Hamzah talks about Haskell’s Big Pitch, the Shark Tank-style event where people within the company present their new ideas. Tyler asks how they vet the ideas. Hamzah talks about Miro digital mapping and a few other steps. He enters these ideas into a database that can be consulted as company needs arise over time. When an opportunity arises, they pull up these ideas and fund pilot programs. 15:12 - Some Specifics Eddie asks for some specific examples of projects Hamzah’s team has guided through this pilot process. He shares an example of a software package. Project managers upload the specifications of their projects and then the software tracks down and compiles all of the documentation required and ensures that all parties have what they need for their respective scope of responsibility. Then reminders can be programmed that will ensure continued documentation is properly collected and organized and distributed. Tyler asks how commonly AI has arisen within these conversations, and we spend some time discussing Sora generative AI. We discuss the changes we’re likely to see in this area within the coming months and years. Eddie wonders if it will discourage our imagination. Hamzah shares about the book The Coming Wave, which recounts the process of training AI to play the game Go. 25:22 - AI Integration Hamzah takes us into a conversation about the ways that AI is increasingly integrated into software such as Revit. We ponder the fact that big companies move slowly, meaning the shift towards intuitive operation doesn’t happen quickly. Hamzah shares some examples of contracts being examined and on some level executed by AI. He also mentions Togel AI conducting safety analysis for jobsites. Eddie shares some thoughts about the reasonable reach of automation. Hamzah’s thought: Verify. Eddie agrees: Check the numbers. Hamzah refers to the importance of highly qualified inspectors–for example stainless steel welding inspectors. He shares about a machine-learning experience they had with training AI to flag questionable welds. One of the lessons? AI is not that easy. Using it with high-value work requires a lot of time, money, and effort. Tyler asks Hamzah to share about cool new tools he’s seen. He mentions Skydio drones that are much more extensively automated in its execution of photogrammetry tasks. 40:36 - The Book Tyler invites Hamzah to share about a big development in his life: He’s writing a book. Hamzah explains that he approached this project as an effort to share the knowledge he’s gained during his many years engaging with innovative ideas in construction. The book is titled Paperless Builders: The Why, What, and How of Construction Technology, and it’s designed for people working in contexts where they don’t have someone to facilitate innovation. Tyler talks about his interest in this subject matter and the mission of sharing information that will serve as a tide to raise all boats. Hamzah is working on building a community of people who can provide perspectives that will help shape his book. If you’re interested in learning more about the book, check out this page. 47:24 - Megaphone Message Think outside the box. Do some research. There are tons of solutions that will make you more efficient, safer, more accurate. Find Hamzah on LinkedIn and at Haskell Check out the partners that make our show possible. Find Us Online: BrosPodcast.com - LinkedIn - Youtube - Instagram - Facebook - TikTok - Eddie's LinkedIn - Tyler's LinkedIn If you enjoy the podcast, please rate us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to us! Thanks for listening

Today's leadership lesson was inspired by what we've recently learned about Joseph Strauss, the somewhat-designer of the Golden Gate Bridge. (You’ll hear more about him in an upcoming full CBP episode.) When you’re in charge of a crew, there’s a natural tendency to want to look good. This is natural, but it’s also dangerous. The good team leader knows that he looks good because of the members of the team. If you’re claiming credit for the final project, you’re blowing the opportunity to give credit where credit is due. Your tendency to claim credit for success should be directly related to your tendency to take the blame when things go wrong. As Eddie says, the call is to accurately represent your contributions. There’s no reason for false humility, but there’s always reason for genuine, circumstantially appropriate humility. People work ambitiously for people who lead this way. Check out the partners that make our show possible. Find Us Online: BrosPodcast.com - LinkedIn - Youtube - Instagram - Facebook - TikTok - Eddie's LinkedIn - Tyler's LinkedIn If you enjoy the podcast, please rate us on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to us! Thanks for listening!

A few weeks ago, Jennifer Wilkerson joined us to discuss training, education, and recruitment. Today we’ve invited her back to talk about women in construction. Jennifer Vice President of Innovation and Advancement at the National Center for Construction Education and Research. 00:00 - All in the Family Tyler asks Jennifer to give a run-down of the welding business that she and her husband own. Jennifer was the business manager for several years after leaving her job as a high school English teacher. Over the years, their two daughters, aged 21 and 31, have taken different meandering routes into that business or the broader construction industry. This means that Jennifer speaks from a position of rich experience when it comes to women in construction. Eddie asks how the job search went for her younger daughter, who shifted to construction from a forensic-science program. Jennifer said that construction companies were quite eager to welcome a young prospect interested in becoming a superintendent. 06:09 - The Obstacles Eddie asks Jennifer to discuss the obstacles that keep women from entering the construction industry. She recounts a survey of elementary-age girls that revealed the primary concern most of them had: “I’m not strong enough.” They simply don’t realize that the construction industry is not all about lifting stuff. Tyler shares about how much he enjoys taking his daughter to Home Depot or to visit a work site. Eddie follows up with some memories about the bros’ grandma, who had a toolbox of her own. Tyler asks about the pressure to recruit women at this moment in the industry. Jennifer says that it’s a matter of need. The industry needs to tap into all sectors of the workforce if it wants to resolve the labor shortage. 10:42 - Research Results Jennifer shares about research that NCCER conducted regarding women in construction. They surveyed 176 tradeswomen to see what changes might make the industry more welcoming. They also studied other surveys that have been on this topic. Here are some of the findings: Women do things more thoughtfully and meticulously in situations where men might to revert to brute strength. Women bring a sense of teamwork and emotional cohesion to a team. Men who worked on teams with women rated themselves higher on productivity then men on teams without women. Jennifer attributes this to the fact that many women are encouragers. Women bring a diversity of perspectives to a crew and a worksite. We talk about that many women got into construction for the money and then found themselves taking great pride and satisfaction in seeing completed projects. 18:10 - Concerns of Prospective Workers Eddie asks Jennifer to share about the concerns that women have coming into the industry. She mentions concerns about sexual harassment but expresses that the industry has come a long way in this area. She gives an example of a company that invested genuine resources and thought toward ensuring that concerns were recognized and addressed. Another concern is accommodation for mothers. She says it’s important to consider some creativity in shift work to enable women to address concerns of childcare. She suggests some other creative solutions, such as designated parking for parents. Many of these family-friendly considerations would be beneficial for everyone. We step into the topic of porta-potties and the fact that most of them are designed with no consideration to feminine hygiene products. The companies say they’ve never been asked for these simple features. Eddie asks about the best ways to ensure that women’s perspectives are making it into planning conversations. Jennifer explains how much of a difference that makes. She encourages women to speak up to the leaders of their organizations. They want to hear. 28:34 - Safety and Team Chemistry Eddie shares his speculation that women are more risk-averse than most men. Jennifer confirms that this is the case. She shares about a woman who plays “Mama bear” as a safety enforcement specialist. Eddie refers to the cowboy mindset that many men take until there’s an accident. Tyler and Eddie share about an experience with a woman who became an integral member of their detailing team. Eddie refers to the clarity she brought to communication and the attention to detail that she brought to the detailing process. 36:29 - Megaphone Message Here’s what Jennifer says with her megaphone this time around: Give women a chance. Be a company that women want to join. Think about your project sites. Ask the women on your team what you can do to be more welcoming to women. Think about your daughter, your wife, your sister. Find Jennifer on LinkedIn Check out the partners that make our show possible. Find Us Online: BrosPodcast.com - LinkedIn - Youtube - Instagram - Facebook - TikTok - Eddie's LinkedIn - Tyler's LinkedIn If you enjoy the podcast, please rate us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to us! Thanks for listening

It’s hot when you weld. Today we’re back around to the topic of young people coming into the industry. Today, we’re specifically discussing ways to help young people with an interest in the construction industry. This conversation brings to mind times when we’ve learned from newbies who are approaching industry-standard software for the first time. We encourage educators and people within the industry to encourage young prospects to explore. Help them wade into the waters of Bluebeam and other software that are at the heart of design and construction today. Here are some links to get you started: Bluebeam’s academic program: www.bluebeam.com/academic Bluebeam University: www.bluebeam.com/bluebeam-university Check out the partners that make our show possible. Find Us Online: BrosPodcast.com - LinkedIn - Youtube - Instagram - Facebook - TikTok - Eddie's LinkedIn - Tyler's LinkedIn If you enjoy the podcast, please rate us on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to us! Thanks for listening!

If you're interested in learning more about the construction of Hoover Dam, scroll to the end of the show notes for links. 00:00 - A Quick Dam Joke, the Consortium, and Some Stats We question our ability to keep our puns in check. Sorry, Mom. Then we move on to the contractors. We discuss the consortium called Six Companies Inc. that won the bid at nearly $49 million, approximately $860 million in today’s dollars. Eddie makes a conveniently timed comparison to the Washington Monument. The Hoover Dam is 726 feet tall–almost 200 feet taller than the Washington Monument. Only 6 buildings in the US were taller than the dam when it was built. We discuss some stats: -4.4 million cubic yards of concrete were used in the project. That is enough to pave a two-lane road from Seattle to Miami or a four-foot-wide sidewalk around the Earth at the Equator or enough to pave a two-lane road from Seattle to Miami. -Its base is as thick as the length of 2 football end-to-end -It has 4 intake towers (30’ diameter each) that can carry enough water to fill 900 bathtubs in only one second. That means 1,448,100 “bathtubfuls” of water will have passed through the dam in the time it takes you to listen to this episode. 07:15 - Construction Costs and Power Output Tyler mentions that the cost of the initial construction, which finished in 1936, wasn't paid off until 1987. Eddie discusses the way that we handle financing for capital projects, spending not just tomorrow’s money–but money that won’t come in for decades. We compare these expenses to the absolutely monumental amount of economic impact that the electricity from the dam has had. Here’s where the 4 billion kilowatt-hours each year goes: 19% to Arizona 23% to Nevada 58% percent goes to California (15% to LA, which is 270 miles away) 10:46 - Hoovervilles and Fatalities Eddie fills the gaps in Tyler’s history education with an explanation of the Hoovervilles from the Great Depression. Hoover didn’t get much positive PR aside from this dam. We discuss the desperation of the Great Depression is shown by the fact that the ability to line up workers for a job to do this. Tyler shares the troubling coincidence is the fact that the first and last men to die on this project were father and son. Thinking about these human costs leads us into a discussion about the structure of incentives and penalties that drove the owners of Six Companies to push the pace of construction. 19:53 - Takeaways: Big Projects, Green Energy, Old-school Drafting We discuss the fact that bold projects lead to emboldened people who move on to even bolder projects. Sometimes biting off more than you can chew leads to growth. Tyler makes the point that this dam was a green-energy project long before the term “green energy” was coined. He also expresses awe at the thought that all of the drafting for this massive project would have been done by hand. Eddie stops short of calling himself a history buff, but he expresses a deep respect for the teams of designers and workers who accomplished massive projects like this with so little help from what we consider advanced technologies. Tyler invites you to submit your ideas for future research-based projects. If you’re interested in additional details about the Hoover Dam, explore these sources: EIA.gov USBR.gov B1M video: compares the world’s largest dams to other structures Lake Mead historical water-level chart NPS.gov Bechtel’s page about construction of the dam Old publicity/education video Library of Congress Photos Video of the physics and engineering involved Check out the partners that make our show possible. Find Us Online: BrosPodcast.com - LinkedIn - Youtube - Instagram - Facebook - TikTok - Eddie's LinkedIn - Tyler's LinkedIn If you enjoy the podcast, please rate us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to us! Thanks for listening

Today we bring you the last of our February series on things we love about the construction industry. Today, we're talking about variety. When it’s Friday and you just wanna go home. What keeps you there? Eddie and Tyler point out that you could be in a dull, repetitive cubicle job that is going to be taken over by AI. But instead, you’re in a field where you encounter something new every day. There are tampers to ride, new guys to send out for the beam stretcher, all kinds of fresh and exciting variety. And, yes, there are new regulations, new owners, new contractors to work with. Is all that variety wonderful? Probably not. Still, it’s not dull. So hang in there at least until lunch. Check out the partners that make our show possible. Find Us Online: BrosPodcast.com - LinkedIn - Youtube - Instagram - Facebook - TikTok - Eddie's LinkedIn - Tyler's LinkedIn If you enjoy the podcast, please rate us on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to us! Thanks for listening!

Today we’re talking to Jeffrey Michael and Darren Draper, two commissioning agents. If you’re not sure what that means, then you’ve come to the right episode. 00:00 - Superbowl reflections We’re not sure what we were thinking to schedule a recording session the day after the Superbowl. Also, we’re sorry that you’re listening yet again to thoughts about Taylor Swift and Travis Kelce just so we can get some SEO juice. 03:21 - Introductions Jeffrey Michael has been in the design and construction world for about 15 years, the last several of those years of that in commissioning. He discusses his earlier experience with manufacturing controls–working with automated guiding vehicles, assembly lines, welding robots, and the like. In the commercial sector, his controls expertise means that he deals with HVAC, lighting, security. Darren Draper is Principal at the Epsten Group. He has been working in commissioning since he left college. Before that, he did summer work with his dad in HVAC work. He shares about how little he expected to end up in the world of controls. 06:56 - Commissioning - the what and the how We ask Jeffrey and Darren to explain commissioning. Darren explains that a commissioner is there to make sure the building operates the way the owner wants it to operate. They make sure the HVAC units and anything else mechanical is operating the way it should. Jeffrey and Darren share a bit about how they do the testing they do. The documentation and protocols involved are numerous. All of this is to ensure that the outputs within an actual building are what the design engineers intended them to be. Darren explains that commissioners want to be hired by the owner so there’s a solid third-party objectivity. We discuss what market/industry forces led to the creation and growth of this position. As building components became increasingly complex, more buildings were reaching the end of the construction process without functioning the way they should. 18:30 - Equipping, informing, and training owners and support crews Darren and Jeffrey explain that part of a commissioner’s function is training the owner’s repair and maintenance specialists on the nuances of their building’s systems. Many of the elements these crews will need to maintain are concealed once construction is complete. The guys share about a recent poultry building they completed and then discuss mission-critical elements. We discuss the importance of functional redundancies that are central to the safety of those who will be using a building. We discuss the importance of effective communication in this process–the need for people to be able to approach training with a teamwork/partnership dynamic. 32:42 - Dealing with conflict Tyler asks the guys to share about how they deal with conflict. They share that tact is incredibly important in their work. Jeffrey talks about tactics for diffusing tension and keeping everyone focused on solutions and a building’s long-term functionality. We discuss how the landscape of engineering, design, and construction have shifted over the years. A few decades ago, most engineers and designers contributing to a project would likely have had at least a little more boots-on-the-jobsite familiarity with the actual construction process. Add to this the product manufacturers who sell a product that can do what it is designed to do only if it is installed properly in the proper environment and surrounded by the proper components. We also touch on outsourcing of isolated parts of the design or engineering process. 45:58 - Designing and building with the end in mind Darren and Jeffrey discuss the importance of designing buildings with controls in mind so that the operational intent of the building is the focus. Jeffrey shares some thoughts about why this is not the way things are done. We explore some thoughts about how disconnects in the industry could be reduced. 01:04:09 - Megaphone Message Jeffrey: Know your worth. Also, in order to know what you do want to do, explore things so you can know what you don’t want to do. Darren: Take pride in what you do. If you don’t like what you do, find something you do like to do and take pride in that. Find Jeffrey on LinkedIn Find Darren on LinkedIn Check out the partners that make our show possible. Find Us Online: BrosPodcast.com - LinkedIn - Youtube - Instagram - Facebook - TikTok - Eddie's LinkedIn - Tyler's LinkedIn If you enjoy the podcast, please rate us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to us! Thanks for listening

We’re back with some more love. Today is the third episode in our “For the love of…” series. Eddie loves solving problems. He loves seeing all of the pieces laid out in front of him and then figuring out how to put them all together. His favorite is solving problems as part of a team. He loves to spitball ideas and build off of the ideas of his teammates until there’s a solid, impressive, satisfying result. Tyler expresses his appreciation for the fact that construction still involves a hefty amount of face-to-face interaction when a group of people get together in a room and hash it out. With coffee, of course. Check out the partners that make our show possible. Find Us Online: BrosPodcast.com - LinkedIn - Youtube - Instagram - Facebook - TikTok - Eddie's LinkedIn - Tyler's LinkedIn If you enjoy the podcast, please rate us on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to us! Thanks for listening!